it's possible to follow a person without ever opening their profile; you can click on their username in chat and a tiny popup opens and you can follow from there
doing this, will result in the channel going up +1 follower without going up +1 views, so you could gain 100 followers this way, and still be sitting a 0 total channel views
though they are not allowed, there are still quite a few bot channels that promote follow for follow and their chats are just hopping with thousands of channels posting "f4f" in chat... and people just click the username in chat and follow each other, while none of them is opening the channels up to look at them.
thus how a channel could end up with 5k+ followers and only have -1K total views on their channel
As for having 1k live viewers during the livestream with 5k+ followers.... perhaps the best place to look is PewDiePie on YouTube, who has 157 MILLION subscribers, yet most of his videos struggle to get even 200,000 views (not even a 1/4 million).... much, much, much fewer then 1% of Peewds followers watch his videos.
On the other hand you have Markiplier and JackSepticEye, both with 24 MILLION subscribers and both averaging 2million views per video. Each of them has only around 8% of their followers who actually watch their videos.
When Ninja was still on Twitch he had 14MILLION followers, yet struggled to get more then 23,000 viewers on any stream. Again, like PewDiePie, much, much, much fewer then 1% of Ninja's followers watched his streams.
It's the same for most everyone.
Normal streamers, can usually expect to see around 10% of their followers, retain as regular viewers... so for every 100 followers a streamer has, they should have around 7 to 10 regular viewers per stream. Someone with 300 followers should have 25 to 30 viewers per stream every stream. Someone with 1,000 followers should have 70 to 100 viewers per stream consistently.
But streamers who do the follow for follow thing, end up with that number being much smaller and will see much, much, much fewer then 1% of their followers watching streams, so for every 100 followers they have, they can expect to see 0 to 1 viewers per stream. Someone with 300 followers should have 2 to 3 viewers per stream every stream. Someone with 1,000 followers should have 7 to 10 viewers per stream consistently.
Of course, that's just general averages and there are lots of additional variables that would cause the numbers to be higher or lower from one channel to the next, but you get the general idea.
So in the end, a streamer with 6.5k followers and only 1k viewers in their live stream is doing WAY better than average. But, a streamer with 6.5k followers and only 1k TOTAL channel views is doing WAY below average.
If you start looking at small channels, you can tell pretty fast which ones have dedicated viewers and which ones don't.
For example, most channels that have 300 followers also only have around 3,000 total channel views. This is normal and typical growth rate for most channels. But some channels with 300 followers have 70,000 total channel views, meaning they have a higher than 60% rate of followers who are also regular viewers retention rate, which is VERY rare on Twitch and is a sign that the channel is growing very fast and on the road to becoming quite a big channel within the next year.
It's far better to have very low follower numbers and very high total channel view numbers, in terms of channel growth, then it is to have high follower numbers but low total channel view numbers. In the grand scheme of things, having big follower numbers is pretty meaningless if those followers are not also viewers, which is why things like f4f are also pretty pointless.
In the end, it boils down to, roughly around 85% to 90% of people who follow you are going to just follow on a whim and never come back, meaning you can usually expect only around 10% of your followers to be retained as regular viewers, BUT when you add follow for follow to the equation, suddenly those averages skew and now you can expect only around 1% of your followers to be retained as regular viewers. The more f4f the streamer does, the more skewed the followers vs viewers number becomes.
On top of that, then you have issues like follow bots, which rarely are done by the streamer themselves and are usually done by someone who dislikes the streamer and follow botted the streamer to try to make them look bad.
But, buying followers is also a thing some streamers do, generally because they are used to YouTube where follower counts ARE very important and affect your pay rate from ads, so they assume Twitch is the same way, not realizing that on Twitch, the follower number is basically meaningless outside of the ego boost it gives the streamer.
Hope that helps explain things.
Wow... this post is as long as one of my answers. Longer, even. I'm not going to paste the entire thing here, as, it's well over a 1,000 words.
Are you referencing the thousands of posts each month by small streamers who get 0 viewers on a daily basis and ask how to increase that number?
Or are you referencing the dozen or so posts today, by fairly large streamers who had 200+ viewers and chatters in their stream, but the total channel view counter in the dashboard did not increase to match because of a site wide glitch that happened today?
Because these are 2 vastly different things.
I fall into the 2nd one. I get around 300+ views a day when NOT streaming and around 700 to 1,200 views during each stream. This has not changed, and yesterday's numbers were typical of this, yet the total view counter has sat at 74,766 for 3 days, in spite of the fact that it SHOULD now be over 77,000 based on how many views I know I got each of those 3 days and based on the numbers in the stream analytics chart.
There is right now a bug, caused by Twitch's removing the total channel view counter from public view on a channel, however, we as streamers, can still see it on our own channels, just not on other people's channels. The posts are referencing the stream manager dashboard page chart of total channel viewers is not updating to match how many viewers they had in their stream, nor is it updating to match the how many viewers the chart in the analytics.
The total channel view counter is off my many thousands of views... this is NOT small streamers asking how to get more then 0 viewers to their streams, but rather quite large channels who get rather big numbers of viewers, asking why the chart on the stream manager page stopped updating.
If you pay attention to the streamers talking about the 0 view bug that just happened, these are not exactly what most would consider small streamers and we are not talking about getting 0 viewers to watch their streams. We talking about, that in spite of no change in our viewers, during the streams, the total channel view counter in the stream manager did not update to match how many views we got during streams.
And that is quite different from the constant steady, daily flood of hundreds of threads from newbies wondering how to get over 0 viewers because they stream to 0 viewers.
As for the streamers complaining they are stuck streaming to no one... if they would open any category on Twitch, they will find they are not alone and every game listed, has a wall of channels sitting at 0 viewers every stream.
It's NOT Twitch's job to send any of us viewers. It's our job as streamers to find ways to both attract and keep viewers. Which admittingly is not easy on Twitch, given that most people join Twitch to become streamers while relatively few people join Twitch to become viewers. Fact of the matter is, there are more streamers then there are viewers on Twitch and if you want viewers to come to you, you need to go outside of Twitch and attract people to you personally, then convince them to join Twitch to see more of you.
In my personal experience, the viewers who stay long term for years, are NOT the viewers who found you via randomly browsing Twitch channels, but rather are people who became your fans via someplace else, and joined Twitch JUST to watch you and you alone.
If I relied on waiting for Twitch viewer accounts to randomly stumble across my channel in search results, I'd probably be sitting at 0 viewers every stream as well.
I'm unusual on Twitch, because while I have only 350 followers, I get nearly EVERY SINGLE ONE of my followers in my streams, EVERY STREAM.
Most people with 350 followers struggle to get 3 viewers per stream.
Most people with 350 followers are struggling to get past 1,000 total channel views while I'm about to cross 100,000 total channel views.
MOST streamers struggle to have more them 1% to 10% of their followers retained as their viewers and yet 90%+ of my followers ARE also daily, regular viewers.
I do know the answer.
I don't sit around waiting for viewers, I go out and find them.
I build art cars, and restore antique cars, and I have an entire fleet of cars that I transport from car show to car show, parade to parade, festival to festival, all over the entire of New England, and I hand out 100+ business cards at the events each and every day, AND on the windows of each car, as thousands of people file past them at the shows, are 11x8 bulletins that tell the history of the car, how I came to have it, and an about me and what I do online, ending with a note that, if you want to learn more, here's my Twitch channel where I livestream.
In between the car shows, I'm also a CosPlayer, and you can find me at any number of conventions. Because of my incoming detailed over the top, often costing over $10k to make costumes, I attract quite a big crowd from the camera shooting crowds at conventions. And everyone who takes my picture, I hand them a business card, exact same business card that gets handed out at car shows.
The card is full color, shows me in CosPlay standing next to The Dazzling Razzberry aka The Autism Awareness car, the one with 2.5million marbles glued to it, and on the back, lists my website, my Twitch, my Twitter, my FaceBook, my Pinterest, and my Tumblr.
ALL of my regular viewers, EVERY SINGLE one of them, is some I meet in person, face to face, and handed a business card to, at one these live events.
So my advice to anyone stuck at 0 viewers and looking to gain more viewers is this:
* Viewers are NOT going to come to you. Like it or not, you are no one and no one is searching for you.
* You MUST put yourself out there and be proactive about telling people OUTSIDE of Twitch, to come watch you.
* People who join Twitch SPECIFICALLY to watch you, are going to watch you and ONLY you, because they did not join Twitch for anyone else.
* If you don't do anything to promote yourself, you'll never gain viewers, because no one else is going to promote you.
* Spamming your channel link on forums, subreddits, Twitter, and other streamers chats is NOT promoting yourself, that is just spamming the hell out of everything.
* The concept of "if you build it they will come" does not apply to building Twitch channels. You must build your channel, then go out there, off Twitch and CONVINCE people why they need to come to your channel. If you sit around waiting for viewers to trickle in on their own, you will have a long wait.
* Promoting yourself OFFLINE via handing out business cards, giving lectures, teaching workshops, signing your books for fans, posing for photos, and doing other such things at events, will gain you more viewers then any sort of "online networking" will ever bring you.
* People who have meet you face to face in person at a live events are more likely to watch you then are people who randomly stumbled across you during random search results in Twitch categories.
* People who have meet you in person, have a connection to you that random browsers who stumble across you online, don't have. They can say: "I meet that guy, he was nice me. I got selfies with him. Look he hugged me, see, here's the picture!" They well forget the hundreds of other streamers they scroll through, but they will never forget YOU, because you were nice to them face to face in person, at a live event. - Make a personal connection with your fans. THOSE are the people who become your regular viewers.
As for your insistence that viewers show talk in chat or get out.... eh... you got a thing or two to learn about Twitch.... like the fact that 70% of Twitch viewers are lurkers and will NEVER post in chat.
And the lurker numbers will continue to grow so long as the troll infestation on Twitch continues to gro, because it i the toxic trolls of Twitch whom have caused so many formerly active chatty viewers to switch to being lurkers.
Myself is a good example:
3 years ago, you could have found me in EVERY Witcher 3 stream chat. ALL OF THEM.
It's been well over a year since I last posted in any chat outside of Cora or Koth's.
Chat as become nothing but a gutter scum hive of trolls either bullying the streamer, bullying other chatters, or slapping their penis on the keyboard while shouting out lewd perversions.
Twitch chat, 3 years ago, rarely saw a troll.
Today? Twitch chat is nothing but trolls.
It is near impossible to find any chat of any streamer that is nothing but porn lusting sex offenders or cyberbullies.
Twitch chat has become vile and I want no part of it anymore.
And your advice to talk with other streamers to gain viewers? That's a load of bull. How many viewers has that REALLY brought you? You admitted yourself you stream to 0 viewers most streams, even when doing 9 to 14 hours.
If you are sitting at 0 views in a 14 hour stream, something is SERIOUSLY wrong with your streams. You should at LEAST have random people dropping in to check out the stream.
Most streamers do only 2 or 3 hour streams then bitch and moan about 0 views, but yeah, a 2 hour stream isn't even going to get you random stragglers.
As for streamers not talking, oh yeah, that IS a big one.
You NEED to be talking 24/7 during a stream, even with no one viewing, even with no one in chat.
Treat it like YouTube and talk to the camera as if the camera was a person.
Streamers who don't talk at all are just as annoying as the streamers who can't stop pausing the game to yap endlessly with chat.
Nothing makes me leave a stream faster then the game paused and the streaming yapping with viewers. I hate that.
But you are stuck with 0 viewers and streaming to no one.
Why are you and hundreds of thousands of others stuck in the streaming to no one 0 viewer rut?
Why do MOST streamer have to hoard up tens of thousands of followers just to reach 10 viewers per stream, while me with my streams, I get nearly the same number of viewers in a stream, as I do my number of followers
What am I doing right, that you are doing, oh so very wrong?
Well, for starters, my viewers are not here to watch my gameplay. They are here to watch me.
And there are certain things to take into consideration as to why 90+% of my followers are viewers, when every other streamer has only -10% of their followers who are viewers.
For one thing, I did not join Twitch to "become a streamer". I do not look at Twitch as a job or a career.
Admittingly, when the average Twitch streamer comes across my channel, their reaction is "What the fuck?" Which is quite understandable seeing how my channel is very unique and, my streams stand on their own as being totally unlike anything else on Twitch. My channel, my profile, and how I run my streams are all very, very, very unique. There is no other channel out their like mine, not on any level at all, whatsoever.
And what that means is, the average Twitch viewer is going to find my channel "too different", "too unique", way too far outside of the norm for what one expects to find on Twitch.
And for MOST Twitch streamers, going so far outside of the norm, is usually going to be a recipe for disaster, because most Twitch viewers have a specific "thing" in mind when they think "Twitch streamer".
Well, if I was catering to the average Twitch viewer, I would sit at 0 viewers every stream, just like tens of thousands of other Twitch streamers do.
Typically a streamer must have 1,000+ followers before they will see 5+ viewers on any given stream, and yet, I at 350 followers, consistently have 100+ viewers on many of my streams, somethings 400+ viewers to a time.
Because I DO NOT cater to the average Twitch viewer and my viewers are exactly that: MY viewers. MINE and mine ALONE.
My followers are not people who joined Twitch looking to watch various random streamers.
My followers are people who never heard of Twitch before, didn't know streaming was a thing, and had they not been one of my fans, they never would have joined Twitch AT ALL.
My followers are people who were my fans in other places, found out I was on Twitch and joined Twitch SPECIFICALLY to watch me, and ME ONLY. No one else.
THAT is the difference, why 90% of my followers are ALSO my viewers, while most streamers struggle to even get 1% of their followers to view them.
My career is elsewhere. Twitch is not my career. But rather Twitch is a TOOL that I use, to allow my fans from elsewhere, to have more interaction with me.
Meaning, for me, Twitch is like email. Email is a thing you have, so that your fans can contact you, but email is not your job, it is just a tool of your job that makes it easier for your fans to reach out to you.
Using Twitch in this manner, results in my having an abnormally high rate of followers who are viewers, because if you are not already a fan of my work outside of Twitch, well, there's really no reason for you to follow my channel.
My channel is NOT your normal, typical, streamer channel, and normal, typical, Twitch viewers simply are not going to be interested in it at all. Which is fine, because, my channel was never intended to be targeted towards the typical average Twitch viewers.
I'm an author. This is my official Twitch channel. Just like I have an official FaceBook page, an official FaceBook group, an official FaceBook profile, an official LinkedIn profile, an official WordPress Blog, you get the idea. No one of these accounts is my job or my career. Each of these things is merely a social network, a place where my fans can reach out to me.
I feel that more people should be using Twitch this way. Not as a career in and of itself, but rather as a social network where their fans from other places can interact with them.
And BECAUSE I am not using Twitch as a job, as a career, and am not randomly running around mad dash mindlessly with no focus spam requesting followers, I am also not mass hoarding up meaningless numbers in my follower list.
My follower list is ACTUALLY MEANINGFUL and made up of people who are my ACTUAL fans. It's not the typical list of dead followers who follow mindlessly with no intention of ever coming back.
That's the secret to getting views on Twitch right there: Be famous elsewhere and bring your fanbase with you to Twitch.
If you make a Twitch account FIRST and try to build a fanbase via Twitch, you're just beating your head against the wall and getting nowhere because you are doing things backwards.
#Twitch is not a place to GAIN followers.
#Twitch is a place to connect with fans you already have from elsewhere.
Use Twitch like THAT and you'll see a vast difference in your ability to go above and beyond the streaming to no one 0 viewer slump.
So, yeah, the regular, normal, average viewers of Twitch are NOT my primary target audience, thus why I do absolutely nothing to reach out to them, market to them, or seek bringing them to my channel.
I am EelKat Wendy Christine Allen: Artist, Author, Art Car Designer.
That is who I have been for decades.
It is what I am known for. It how I am known.
People don't know me as EelKat Wendy Christine Allen: Gamer.
People don't know me as EelKat Wendy Christine Allen: Twitch Streamer
People don't know me as EelKat Wendy Christine Allen: YouTuber.
People know me as EelKat Wendy Christine Allen: Artist, Author, Art Car Designer.
People know me as EelKat Wendy Christine Allen: Owner of The World's Most Haunted Car - The REAL Christine
People know me as EelKat Wendy Christine Allen: Founder of The Procter & Gamble Boycott.
People know me as EelKat Wendy Christine Allen: Voodoo Priestess, Queen of the Scottish Gypsies who were featured in Stephen King's The Thinner, the REAL "Gypsy Witch" of Stephen King's Thinner;
People know me as EelKat Wendy Christine Allen: Etiole's Friend.
No one Google's me as a video game player.
No one searches Bing for me as a streamer.
Why would they? It's not what I'm known for.
So while my name gets tens of thousands of hit per day in searches, no one ever searches for me in connection with Twitch.
Why would they?
They search for my name in connection to the things I am known for.
Twitch is just a social network. A place people, fans, clients, can network with me.
Twitch is a tool to help me further reach my clients.
Twitch is not a place where I try to make a buffoon of myself for random teenagers. I'm not like other streamers on Twitch...
* I'm not here to kiss the mighty viewer ass
* I'm not here to be a circus clown for 12 year olds
* I'm not here, to shake my boobs at perverted men.
* I'm not the average streamer who plays the bimbo buffoon in hopes of getting coins tossed at me from children and garbage men
And thus the average, viewer of Twitch - the retarded 12 year olds who can't string a full sentence together, and the registered sex offenders who roam Twitch in search of teenage girls... they are not my target audience. I don't like the average filth that slimes it way through Twitch.
I'm on Twitch for my fans. People who followed my work for years. Decades.
I use Twitch the way it is SUPPOSE to be used, the way it was INTENDED to be used, by it's creators... as a social network... a place to connect with people interested in my work.
I mean... this channel IS the official Twitch channel of EelKat Wendy Christine Allen, an extension of my business, an extension of my brand, and extension of my career, it is the official Twitch channel of an author.
That's who I am. That's what I am. I'm an author. I'm not a streamer.
Twitch is part of my business model, but it is not itself my business.
And Twitch being an extension of my business is WHY I wield the ban hammer firm and heavy around here to obliterate any trace of the the retarded children who escaped their babysitter and the the vile gutter scum sex crazed pieces of trash filth.
I do NOT allow children in my workplace, and THIS is an extension of my workplace.
And I do not allow vile, sex scum trash near any part of my life, nor do I allow them here.
My fans, they are welcomed here... but the average filth that roams through the bulk of Twitch, is NOT allowed here.
Streaming is a thing that I happen to do, but it does NOT define me, it is NOT who I am. It is JUST a thing that I do.
But streaming is an extension of who I am, and is defined by my values, my morals, my business, my career, my profession, and I treat this place professionally.
The average viewer of Twitch it looking for desperate, needy, big tittie bimbos to play the bafoon for them, and that's not who I am, and they are not the audience I cater to.
And THAT is WHY my follower to viewer to total view count ratio, is so vastly different from yours and most every one else's on Twitch.
Think about it.
And next time you feel like complaining about streaming to no one and having 0 viewers... think about what I said here, and take a good long look at WHY you are on Twitch.
What is your goal?
Why are you here?
Are you here for money? Fame? An ego boost from seeing numbers go up? If so, none of those are good reasons to join Twitch and, you'll just be endlessly disapointed.
Use Twitch as it was intended to be used: to share updates on your daily life with your fans from elsewhere, and you'll find Twitch more fun, less of a grind, and thoughts of numbers will soon go away as you realize how meaningless numbers really are.
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